I Caught a Light: Francis Doom speaks on Creating Music, Being Proud to be Korean, and How to be Vulnerable When Making Art

0:05 Welcome to the Holly Hughes podcast. I am very happy to be speaking with the Francis Doom. He's got the deep ethereal voice that women go crazy for and he is an indie alternative rock singer-songwriter. They're just like the all around thing. Oh, and we'll also be touching upon the book talk quotes for sure while we talk. So welcome, Francis. Thanks for coming today. Thanks for having me. See, it's the voice now. So now, now I'm going to ask you to be like, hey, can you just say welcome to the Holly Hughes podcast? All right, welcome to I can't do. That look here I'm.

0:47 Too unserious. So when did you know you were a musician? Honestly, from an early age, I, I knew that I, I wanted to do music and, you know, throughout my life my motivations might have changed, you know, as a little. Kids. I just thought it was just so cool, like wow, like and and some of my earlier influences you you might it's kind of funny. Like the first group that I loved was like boys to men. I just thought they were the coolest and they are the. Coolest they are Yeah. For. Sure. And. I'm like, I have their soundtrack in my head now. Yeah, You don't want to hear me sing. That's the last thing anyone wants to hear because this is a direct quote from my mother, who loves me so much. And she really does.

1:34 It's like, thank God You Can Dance, Holly, because you sure Can't Sing. But those are like the best people to do karaoke with because it's just more fun when you. Would like me and Nora Bong in Korea but I don't. I'm not brave enough to do it here. It's the worst one of these days. But so, yeah, I mean, the the, the the desire to be cool. I feel like that sort of drives a lot of young kids because like no one's like 8 and like they're like, I want to master the Craftsman, you know, like of like, like the craft of music, you know, it's like now I want to be cool. So, you know, early age was that and that got that drove me through like, you know, teen years, like wanting to just well. Be real, be like, be honest there.

2:16 I just wanted, I wanted that one and I wanted that one and I want to be on stage and like look over. I want to talk about that. That whole presence of being on stage. That's a huge part of being a musician. But I also like want to know how many instruments you play and which one did you start with then? Also, like every good Asian boy, I started with piano kicking screaming. Ironically, I hated it. My parents made me and so they forced me to go take lessons and when they finally let me quit, I feel like a couple years later I like went back to the piano and I'm like, oh, I like this and so and that.

2:56 Honestly, piano is if anyone is thinking about starting their kids on an instrument, I recommend piano. It's just, you know, every note is literally in order from left to right. You can do chords with melody, unlike let's say for learning flute, it's like kind of just melody or violin. So you can have an entire orchestration at your fingertips and you're learning, you know, you're you're learning multitasking. And it's just, yeah. So that, that was a really good introduction. Yeah. I learned the organ. I know I'm as a 70s kid. Oh, sexy, right? Two hands, two different levels, foot pedals. It was a lot it. Was the one downside is that you can't exactly pull out an organ to impress? The girls.

3:42 At the beach, yeah, No. It was in the basement. Come on. I was like, oh thank God. Actually so cool though. I'm like picturing you in a dark dingy. Basement no, you have to imagine like the wood paneling and the stucco cement on the steps on the way down and like I still my left hand still nodes my cords CFD GC like I could still do it. OK, we're gonna jam one of these days. I don't. I don't have thing here. Yeah, for me it was Oregon. So cool guitar, saxophone that those are the three do. You know how to play those? Not anymore, I can definitely play piano and read music, but like very poorly now. Like it used to just come that I really wanted to learn guitar, but my guitar teacher and in hindsight I had really good instincts. He would sit behind me.

4:29 It was really creepy and he would like, I could feel him breathe. I was like, Nama, I don't I don't think I want to go there again. Like that was weird. And then I really wanted to learn to play saxophone like quarter flash and like, who can it be? Like just whatever the 80s saxophone. There was a time when the saxophone was this shit, right? Alto sax except for like 2-3 factors for me personally, which is why I love musicians in general. Which is when you practice because so much practice has to go into it. There's no muting A saxophone, right? It's loud. There's. No volume. Knob no volume and the read like to get it the right wet right whatever.

5:15 I also didn't like that it because I was like 1516. I was like my lip is going to get hard. What are you talking about? No, that's like a hard pass. And the ultimate reason was I could not hit the note G Like I couldn't hit that unless I rolled my eyes back. I was like, that is not cute. I quit. Just couldn't find that GI. Just couldn't. Don't you figure out there? Nice, nice. Back to you. OK, so so piano. Piano and then in my rebellious like 13 year old 12, I, I found drums and that I just loved like that was like, I think that was when I'm like, Oh, I'm going to do this like I, I did.

5:58 I, I practiced so much and no one made me and I just put in my headphones And at the time it was just like a bunch of like metal songs because I went from R&B boys to men to metal. Which metal? What is your metal? What was it? Honestly back then it was anything I could find. You know, it was pre streaming music so it was whatever CDI could get my hand on. But honestly, at the time it was like Metallica and and then I got until really, really into like Deftones, still love Deftones. Anything that screamed, anything that was angry, I was like cool, like my bar was so low. And then so I played in bands from sort of that point on as a drummer and then, you know, found melody and chords with guitar. And so and then I play a little bit of cello. I always say I don't play anything great, but I play like a couple things decent, which is actually really handy for a songwriter because as a writer, you it's not even the need to execute everything perfectly.

7:05 You know, the, the, it's just the need for an understanding of these different instruments so that you can make these songs with all the different parts and arrangements. Yeah. So like, where did sliding Down the Hill start then? Like if you're writing your own music, like, yeah, so. I think that probably came from a chord progression, like on the piano, just blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, that arpeggiating thing. And and then probably, yeah. So I mean, what would that usually? It either starts on piano or guitar usually. And I'll like recorded in Logic and then just start adding instruments. And honestly, thank God for technology.

7:46 Thank God for recording software because I'm not a Mozart. I'm not a or a modern day reference would be like a Jake Jacob Collier or Brian Wilson who can like just hear it in their head and be like, cool and then like, right. And I, I don't even get how that happens. I'm going to record it and then toy with it, fuss with it, you know, and layer on top. I I without modern technology, I would not be, you know, a compose. I don't. I couldn't be the composer that I am writing. OK, so do you start with then you like a melody or a note or an idea like where does it start? Or is it like the poetry of the lyrics that started like all songs are lyrical like that way to me so. I mean, I always say there's no wrong answer, right? Like if you ask me, I say melody is king. I find the melody over chords, and then I try to make the best words fit into that.

8:42 But still, even if the best word doesn't sound because different syllables, different vowels sound differently in different moments, if that doesn't sound good, I don't care. There's no hard rule. Like sometimes. OK, so yeah. But usually melody is king. But if you ask like someone like a Bob Dylan. Hear about him I'm talking to? You about I would say like but he would say like lyrics are king, right, But yeah, me melody is king. Try to find that perfect spot of like having the best lyrics fit the best melody. And honestly, there's so many songs that I love that I've heard a million times. And if you ask me what the lyrics are, I might not be able to tell you.

9:23 I could tell you what syllables like I feel like sound, I could sing along to it. And syllabolically, that's not a word. I love that word. It's a new word. But it but sometimes I'm like, I realize like, oh, I've never even thought about like what the words are. OK, this is this is going to be my favorite question now. So is there a song lyric that you've gotten really wrong that you swore was really right? Like because you don't. Hear. Right, like there are like 1,000,000 songs where that has happened. I don't know. One that comes to mind is like, I mean, Radiohead's like my favorite band. And I remember being at a Radiohead concert and there was this like this, this line that is such an important line apparently.

10:03 Because like, when this moment came, this sort of like the he stopped singing and so the crowd could sing it. And so I sung what I thought it was. I don't really remember what, Yeah, I don't remember what, what, what it was, but I remember everyone saying it and me saying something completely different with my fist in the ear, you know, because it's like, and then just feeling so dumb because, because I clearly got it so wrong. But yeah, that that happens all the time. I love it. OK, so how many concerts have you like? Did you go to where you're like always going? When you I used to go to a lot. It's it's kind of sad how how not often I go to concerts now.

10:46 It's like, it's such a shame, like what I do and but I've gotten a little bit lazy. But yeah. And honestly, right now it's like, because back then I would just go to a show to go to a show, right? Get out of the house and, you know, there's just like a community when you're young of like my friend's band is playing here and, you know, there's like a scene. And as you get older, you're not in the scene anymore. So you just go kind of you kind of just go see the bands that you love and not the bands that you like. Like, you know, which is unfortunate because yeah, I mean those bands need. Prices went up like it's like a whole thing now. Like to go to the show?

11:27 And I'm like, so I'm in Charlotte and people don't come to Charlotte, they go to Atlanta. Like on a good day, that's a 5 hour drive. Yeah, like you're killing me. That's wrong. I don't know if I ever drive 5 hours to go to a show. Yeah, there. Just saying. But soon, Oh no, I would totally go play there. But you know. Obviously, obviously. OK, so a bunch of instruments like did you go to school for music? Like was your family behind your music or are they like. I'm actually quite illiterate when it comes to OK so how? How do I equate?

12:10 It's like knowing how to speak without knowing how to read. I can't read music off of a sheet, but I know music theory, you know, to play. So once my parents kind of saw me getting really into music, they got me, they saw me getting too into music to where it was the only thing that mattered. And that's not good for Asian parents that want doctors and lawyers. So they would, my mom would sort of use it as an incentive like, OK, I'll pay for drum lessons or guitar lessons if you get good grades.

12:52 And then I wouldn't get good grades because I just was so bad in school. So then they would stop. So I remember, yeah, my drum lessons and guitar lesson like they stopped. And so really just became, and there was like no YouTube back then. So I started to learn it through a bit by ear and a lot through like friends. Like friends that played guitar, like them showing me what they knew when I was like this exchange. You learn a song and then you show your friend how to play it. So is it like a tactile learning for you? Like I'm really curious. I'm trying to figure out like where music lives in you, right? Like when I like dance, right is I still dance.

13:33 It's like it just it's like inside out. Like I just got to get it out. I got to do it, but I have no ability to choreograph nor do I want to. So I'm like really fascinated between the juxtaposition of having music in you and needing to get it out and like, how does it come out of your hands? Like where does it start? And also like the difference between in performing like your version of creep, right, which is out in there. And I could tell how much you like it. How did you learn if you're learning from your friends? Like I can't learn from a screen. Like if I was in student today, I would not be very good because I just, I'm easily distracted by this and it it's not 3D enough for me to touch. So if you're learning music in a tactile way, because it's your, you know, friend or someone near you, is the first thing that makes sense like how the chord feels in your hand? Or is it like a feeling that you want to connect with and so you learn the music of the feeling?

14:33 Did that make sense? Yeah, I, I think so. And so when you're starting out and you've not really learned the language yet, you and you're just sort of imitating people that speak the words. Again, this is my poor analogy of language and music. It is very tactile because you don't know why that chord works yet. So you're just doing the thing and you're just like, OK, cool. So it's very yeah. And then, but once you start to realize why notes, certain notes work together and why certain notes don't, then it becomes a bit more cerebral and, and you sort of get to learn the rules of what to do and what not to do. And then when you, and then when you get even more comfortable, then you get to learn there are no rules. And then you, you know, like once you, you have to learn the rules to get to learn which ones you can break and which ones you can't basically.

15:26 So it becomes less time, less sort of physical then and a bit more cerebral. But because, again, lyrics are secondary. So it's not like a song starts off with me being like, I need to express this thing. It starts off like, I want to hear this sound and I don't think I hear it right. I can't find a song that like sounds like that. So let me just try to make it. And then a lot of times I'll make it and be like, oh, that's why it sucks. OK, cool. So this like thing that works in theory in my head, I, I, I, I, you know, you make it a thing and then it's like, OK, that's why it doesn't exist. I feel that. I feel, I feel like I've experienced that same thing.

16:10 I'm fascinated that you are in search of sound like that's like nothing I've experienced or. Yeah, well, like. That's amazing. Again, when you're starting you, all you want to do is imitate your heroes. So you're not making anything new because you're, again, you're learning the language. So you're I heard this thing where Hunter S Thompson would word for word rewrite Moby Dick just and and and not adding anything, but just to learn the rhythm of his favorite writers that sort of choices. And then from there on out, you sort of take what you like and you add it to your arsenal as a writer. That's. Fascinating. That sounds like punishment to. Me, yeah, a little, a little bit, right. Doesn't sound fun to me, but that's like really what doing a cover is you're, you're learning the choices that this other artist made and then adding what you like to your arsenal. But.

17:07 It's kind of fascinating. I'll keep going back to create. We also did like Alanis Morissette recently. So like I'm you have as a person who isn't musical in a way that I would ever claim it, but loves music, right? I always have it going on for me. You have that right. Like that's your sauce. You're like the, like you like that. I don't say I don't know how to like say that because I don't have a vocabulary of music, which is part of why I want to have these conversations. But like you have that. Interesting thing that I can't quite read you like in a way that I was like, OK, so you have this softness, but you play indie rock and there's like some guttural thing that's dying to come out. I just keep thinking I'm like, where's like, is it? Are they gonna scream now?

18:02 But that's when you like, bring in more dynamics with your music, right? So I'm. Yeah, I'm not much of A, you know, it's weird when when I was a kid, I, I had a really good scream. I don't know where it went or what happened, or maybe puberty. Are you too happy? Maybe maybe I was kind of happy then, but no, actually I wasn't at all. And maybe that's what it is, But even now I can't really scream and when I try, it doesn't really sound great. But I I've always loved the pairing of ethereal, whispery, soft vocals against I mean, again, Deftones, right? He like it sounds like, I mean, he does scream, right? And he has a killer scream. But there are parts where it sounds like if you isolated the vocals, it could be like an Enya song or something like and then you.

18:48 Oh my God, I haven't heard that name in forever. That's amazing. That's amazing, showing my age. But. And, you know, you pair it against the proper instrumentation and that dichotomy creates something special. And so while I love music that sort of hits, yeah, I don't think I think I'll let the bass or the drums sort of be that thing and and and let the voice be a little bit softer, but. It just dipped. You're like, oh, I. Don't know it's it's my morning voice even though it's sad. Excellent. That's excellent. I'm like, I think I'm like wondering because you brought up being Asian and I am not for anyone who's just listening and can't figure that out. I think I'm like curious culturally, do you think anything from your house or your culture or like what you were surrounded by also influences your choices or how you want to make music?

19:47 Or do you have to just prove it wrong? Be like no I wasn't a lawyer but damn bitch boom I make I'm doing good. Well, I'll say this when I was young, probably a lot of Asian Americans can relate to this. I wanted to push away my sorry, I want to push away my Koreanness as much as I can. I wanted to be just like my American friends that have, you know, pizza and, and burgers for dinner instead of weird Korean food. And, you know, I wanted to just be as American as I can. And when as I get older, I I realized the amazing things about my ethnicity, that Korean food, it fucking rolls so good.

20:29 I cook. It so I'm there I'm. There and Korean cinema. Great. You know, that there's things about my sort of roots that I'm embracing now in my later years. So for example, Francis Doom. My my. OK, so my American name is Francisco, but I've always hated it for some reason. I don't know why. Maybe because like, well, you know, kids would call you like Francis or, you know, like like a dig. And then so I always went by Jay, cuz that's oddly enough that's my Korean name. Anyway, so my whole life I went by Jay.

21:09 And then with this new project, I'm like embracing all the things that I didn't like about, you know, so Francis, like the sort of the dig that I sort of ran away from. It's like part of the reason why this project is called that. But but yeah, all these things about my past that I always sort of ran away from, I'm sort of embracing now. I don't even know how we got here. It's good. I like that. I told you, I told you I don't. We don't have to be linear. That's the best part, too. Artistic because my brain does not work linearly. It's all good. It's all good. No, I was just curious because I hear a lot of people, I guess for me nowadays, everyone's sticking a label on something, right?

21:53 You're this, you're that, you're this. And I think all the labels divide where I grew up. I felt very other as well, like I just felt other. I didn't see the world the way literally other people did. I didn't experience. I just didn't know why my purple shoes bothered people. I just was like, this is who I am. I'm still that way. If you don't like me, leave me the fuck alone. Like if you do like me, sweet. Otherwise you're like, we could. You don't have to like me. Just don't be mean. Like that's my thing. So for me, when I ended up being in LA and living there for 18 years, I was so surrounded by other people who were just as curious about the world, right?

22:35 So I'm just listening to people tell so many stories about how they felt other and it could be ethnicity or race or religion. And I think nowadays we're putting all of that out there so much. So I don't know how to like ease it. And I don't know how people can get into like loving and accepting. Do you think it was just the time? Do you think it was because your household was different? Like I'm just kind of curious, like how I might be damaging my own teenager because she's got a weird mother and I have so many influences around me because I'm just curious. Like, do you think you would have the same feeling of being embarrassed by your Korean American heritage if you were growing up now? Oh, good question.

23:26 Sorry, now I see. I'll get, I'll get your language. We'll get this synced. In Hold on, let me take a big chunk of coffee, yeah. Yeah, drink your coffee. I have a sip of water. That is a great question. And I actually, I'm, I'm smiling right now thinking about it because, because Korean food is sort of mainstream now. So it's, I remember bringing it to lunch and Kate's being like, that smells weird, but. Like what would you be like? What would you bring? Being like, what would you bring? Yeah, like whatever my, you know. Whatever she. Leftovers from Yeah and it's kind of a happy thought that a kid might bring it to school now and kids would be like whoa like you know I guess saw that on like Anthony Bourdain like so I hope that's the case that that that that's a really beautiful thing actually.

24:12 I mean, especially with for all the downsides of the Internet, right, one of the few upsides is everyone can find their people that for all the weirdos, you can find your community of weirdos that are weird, weird in similar ways as you, you know, because everyone's weird, but weird in similar ways as you. And K pop is like big now. So maybe maybe kids aren't as ashamed to be courteous as I was. I don't know like. Like, just like, were your parents like, like are you first generation? Yeah, first generation. OK. Yeah, my mom was literally pregnant with me when she came here, and I was I was born here, so I just made it.

24:57 Yeah, let's not go there. You knew, you read my brain. I'm psychic. I'm. Psychic is my face that transparent that. Yes, you are. To me, you're quite. You're like if you are a very fascinating mix of person in that you are transparent and guarded, Ish Gray and like. Yeah, like, like I feel like the inner thoughts debating and judging what might come out, I'm like just just likely you. Know my God, you are so good at reading people because that's. Literally clairvoyant like so like, that's what I do. But no, seriously. So like I was like. I am, I tell people that because I could just go there.

25:38 If you can handle it like we can, we can go there. But that is also fascinating because again, we are strangers, right? And so I usually ask permission. Can I read you some? And then if you say yes, then I'll get more. I really try to not be like invasive that way because I can know things about you that maybe you don't want me to know about you. So I try to keep a really good boundary. I had this strange person, literally strange, come up to me at an event I was at. And I could tell that they were also like intuitive and whatever. And I could feel like her energy coming at me. So it felt like, it felt like hooks coming at me.

26:20 I was like, whoa. I looked at her. I go, yeah, no, I didn't give you permission. She's like, you can feel that. I was like, yeah, no, like a big NO. But I'm going to get to a really simple question. As a musician, you are sharing yourself physically and emotionally with strangers all the time. How much do you give and how much do you keep for yourself? When it comes to like the writing, I try to give everything because who wants to hear a song about how cool you are, right? Like, it it. It should be embarrassing and it should be vulnerable, right? Because what is art if not that?

27:06 But then when it comes to marketing, admittedly, I I do definitely just try to be cool, like just try to come off cool and like, I hope you like me. I hope you like this song. You know what I mean? Like. That is not how you you come out. Like I have all these like little notes. Wait, all my awesome post. Its I told you about. I was like, I was thinking about this a lot before, like we started talking about like sex appeal, right. Like so there's Trappy. You've got the voice you have you're awesome followers who like beg you to say things. Yeah, which they're very funny. I think I found you originally from Book Talk. Oh wow, interesting.

27:48 So like I heard you reading things. I was like, this is too much. And then I would read the comments and I would be like, I stamp my foot when I laugh really hard. I would just be like, ladies easy. And then I was like, I guess anonymity. I, I don't whatever it is that they have or that they're doing, I don't do. It doesn't mean that clearly you're we don't have those parts, but you are marketing your sexuality in one way or other. What's that feel like? Well, see. Your face. I wish I. Had a. Mirror. Oh wait, you'll see the video OK. So I don't actually look at it as marketing my sexuality. I may be using sexuality to market the music, but you know, all of it is to market the music, which is why I always stick the song at the end, you know. But yeah, that that's an interesting one because, well, first of all, sexuality is a part of me. I am, you know, not that I'm depraved, but you know, it's semi DNA.

28:58 It's it's a part of who I am. You're. A grown person, Yeah. Good. You know, sexuality is fun too. So I'm showing these bits of who I am that's gonna fall into it, along with my weird sense of humor, along with my emo sincerity along with all of it. Yeah, so there's that. The thing about the book talk stuff that is kind of weird is that I just like when people request covers, I'm like, oh, I love that song. I get it. I get why you want that. It's a beautiful song. With the book talk stuff, I'm like, I don't really get it, but it helps the music. So OK, like, I mean, like as far as my voice, I'm like, I don't get like there's dudes on here on on TikTok with like the British accents and like, oh, I get that.

29:45 That dude kills it. Like he, you know, he nailed it. So there, there's that. But then there's also like, I also don't like let it get to my head because my voice, it's like it's pairing with an image that they have in their head of this character that I am not from this book that did things that I did not to. Oh. I think you're wrong. What? It is a pairing of if you want to know, wait, I have to do your 80 age brain. I have to go slower. Yeah, Yeah. Your brain is so fascinating. Like right now, it's like Tetris, like moving cubes around. It's fascinating. It's like they have an image of you that you share, right? So they have this and we'll do your emo, right?

30:27 You've got like the Moody backlit Mike lean forward, hair coming. Like it's the whole fantasy, right? Like you have like a significant fantasy that you're giving and you have a great voice, right? I don't want you to think I'm just making fun. I I'm very sarcastic, so just. No, me too. Me too. Please. Deprecation is like my own language. So then you have like that you have that fantasy along with whatever that line is that they also have it. They're just, you're just, you're like the double fantasy for like that whole thing. And if if I had that ability and could keep a straight face, I would be there like I'd be like, yeah, let's let's totally do that. But I would. That's why the videos are so short, because I can't keep a straight face.

31:09 No, Andy, my producer knows how I feel about listening back to like these podcasts is brutal for me. No, I know it's like watching your sex tape. It's like like why do I look like that? Why did I do that thing with my anyways? But. See, now you're just adding fuel to those women inspires. They're like, wait, they're like they're going through. They're like he has a tape somewhere. There was before Francis doom, I was in the previous band and I very much pushed away social media and like AI guess if I'm too cool or something. I don't know, too shy, too afraid. And with this new project, I told myself I'm going to do everything to try to make this work.

31:53 Everything that's with within who I am. I mean, you know, I'm not going to start an only fans, but, you know, embrace social media. And so I made a TikTok for the first time and and and then this book talk thing and turns out it's a good conduit for people to check out my music. I honestly, if it wasn't all for like if the end game wasn't for people to find my music, I just wouldn't do it. But so, yeah, so I'm just, you know, embracing all the all the things. I, I know plenty of, I know a lot of authors, but I was like, oh, so I think I've sent them a few of them here. I was like, for your book here, maybe. What do you think?

32:34 Because I, I love doing that. That's just like so fun. Well, that's, I mean, this led me to this whole thing led me to doing voice over like narration for and that's a separate thing that's just to pay the bills and, you know, separate from the music. But but yeah, it's fun. Yeah, like work it, you have like you have the tool, you might as well really like explore and go to town with it. Like I love that. I love that. I hope by by the tool you're talking about not just stop. We're gonna have to air this one at night. There'll have to be a rating on this one. I haven't joked like this with other people. It's so funny, but it's like. It's a safe space. It's just, it's just my sense of humor. I am really particular, which is probably why my social media isn't very big yet. I'm really guarded about like my privacy. And I think it's because I did write that essay about getting thrown on a table and dry humped in front of a crew, a film crew, and it went viral because it was published before I knew it was going out.

33:33 And it was only when there was Twitter. So there wasn't really it's like Facebook and Twitter. So there was no, it was a long time ago, all the rest of it. And I had thousands of messages from people telling me they were typos. I was like, really, bitch, this is like what you're telling me? But it was a lot of attention. And then it got tension attention in LA and the Directors Guild had a meeting. They had a meeting like they called in all their members and I had friends there and they were telling me it was about me. They weren't using my name, but people like would not stand up for me or verify it for fear of not working right. So I'm really protective of who knows this part of me. Like, are you going to twist that? Like what's going to come back?

34:22 I I think like the safety of that is still unknown. I'm kind of Gary. Nah, it's crazy. Yeah, wait. So OK, I'm going to do some digging after this. Yeah, OK. But this is about you. Anyway, OK. OK, so you wrote a song about your dog. Was that really about your dog? Yeah, it was. No. Where is the dog? How can we stop in the background? You know, she's out there. She's being very lazy. That's a good morning. Yeah, she's, she used to have so much more energy. Yeah, she's getting older and it's making me sad. But actually, that's what the song was about. It's, you know, I don't write many love songs because I just think, well, you know, there's just a lot of them in the world and maybe that's the last thing we need is another love song, although maybe not, but is there? A song like about a love song from the 70s. And that's how it's.

35:21 You need to do that one. Yeah, yeah. But you know, I the song's about I do this thing with with Layla and my dog where because I think about I'm so fucked. This is, I think about our last moments a lot like what it's going to be like because, you know, the dog's lifespan is so short and so. My dog just died 2 weeks ago. So sorry. I know. Thank you. Animal. Animal deaths. Like don't even. Harder than human deaths, I swear. But, you know, I think about her on this cold metal table at the vet's office and not knowing what's going on and me not being able to convey what I want to convey because we don't speak the same language, right? And so I always do this thing now and I've done it for years where I, you know, hold her head like I do when I put my forehead against hers.

36:13 And I just repeat, I love you. I love you. I love you. And not because like the words themselves mean anything on an English language, like, you know, but I just, I want, I want to build that association so that in those final moments when I do that, she will know one that I'm here and, and that she's. Yeah, vibration though, like literally your voice is right because you've got that that we keep talking about. Like you have that tone that that's exactly what I did with my dog. I just held him. I was like, I love you, I love you, I love you. See, now I'm going to get. I'm sorry and and I try not to say it when I leave like cuz sometimes it it comes out and I'm like, I got to catch myself cuz it's like I don't I don't want her to associate. I love you with I'm leaving now.

37:03 Bye. So I I I just missed a? Lot of thought. I know so so sometimes I say it like just cuz I do love her and then I realized I've said it. I have to hang around for like another like minute and 1/2, you know, just like oh shit, I said OK. Like I sort of like, wait, I, I don't know about your personal life because I'm not a stalker, but I was like, so now like the all I'm thinking is you can say I love you as you leave. I like, it's the perfect thing. Like no baby, you said I love you. I get 5 more minutes. Yeah. Yeah. So that that's why the song is called Little Words, because it's, you know, the, you know these words, it's like they're like small little boxes and you're trying to pack so much meaning into them. Like I think like in my world, how I experience it is like, so sound like we all know has wavelength so it has energy, so it comes and moves anyway even if someone doesn't understand it as does.

37:55 Like when you don't make fun, I can't drum. Like when you're drumming. You're doing it. That's. Or like, I love that song. Go on. It's the best one. My 8 age opinion is like I just went to a whole other story. I was like you are giving all that moment. I would not worry. I'm telling you like that the dog gets it and don't worry about saying I love you and not they don't. They're not that deep after a while even though we want them to be. But I want to know. Also another lyric is you like you look like hell but you wear it well. So is that you or someone else? So that is or. Is that not your lyric? But it was your music, because you're the music guy. Well, I mean, it's all, it's all my lyrics, but it's, you know, so OK, going back to love songs that have been written millions of times.

38:42 I want to write a love song about, you know, there's plenty of songs and movies about young love, young exciting love. And then and then they finally get together and then and credits, right. But what about the love that remains 30 years later, like old, weathered, sustaining love, Right. And that's the sort of love I want to write about. So that's the songs about this couple that are like later in life and they're sort of out on the town, like trying to feel young again, realizing that it's just not them and the silliness of it all. And. And then, you know, they get home and they send the babysitter home and, you know, and then they're people just trashed and, you know, exhausted and but but yeah, but you know, that's sort of like you look like hell. Like I I pictured like, you know, my wife with our future child one day and just baby vomit just like here and her hair like this.

39:45 And but just saying you look like hell, but it's just beautiful because it's it's just a beautiful, you know, it's such a beautiful thing that that's sort of what all that indicates, you know? I mean, I'm there for I'm 22 years, so same relationship. I'm like, that's crazy. Really. Yeah. Yeah, 20 years married. We were married in LA for 7:00, so we count those in dog years. So that's 49 plus. Like that's our joke because the minute he got a ring, women hit on him more. Ah, I'm like, we're out to dinner. I'm right here like. Maybe people are getting Polly vibes, you know, I mean.

40:26 I'm, yeah, I'm. I'm way too jealous of a person for that. I could never Polly. I could not Polly in real life. I am so ridiculously faithful that this is so funny. I had a dream about Jason Momoa because Jason Momoa and he like went to hug me and I was like, dude, I'm married. I woke up. I was like. You wouldn't even in your dream. Come on, live a little, just in your dream. I know, I mean I have a really good imagination, but asleep I was like, I woke up. I was like what is fucking wrong? Listen, next time you dream about Jason Momoa, I want you to tell yourself this is the one time I can do. This. I have permission. I'm sure my husband would give me, but he was like, whatever. Yeah, it's Jason Momoa.

41:11 I can't. Hello. It's so funny. He's like, whatever. You don't need to know it anyway. OK, So I'm going to give you one piece of advice that I want you to remember whenever you have children. If you have children reading, it's the best thing you could do. If you want to still be romantic with your wife when there's an infant in the house, wash the bottles. Wash the bottles. Wash bottles. Washing bottles is foreplay. What? Yeah. Interesting. And do a little laundry. Yeah, like do I have? Because wash them in a suggestive sort of. Manner you just have to wash them. I don't think this is suggestive, but like, I don't know who you're married to it.

41:56 I mean, like, again, that's your, that's your own whatever I think. Picture like. It's just because you're a napkin like when the baby is young, right? You have like the vomit doesn't go nicely on your shoulder. What happens is you're up for hours on end and you finally get to make a cup of coffee. You put the baby in a little bouncy chair and you put your coffee down and pour the Creamer and the baby will projectile vomit into the Creamer and. And. Then you're just like, that is not the Creamer I wanted. These are not the droids you were looking for. I was like, no. So if you do the little things that will never not be there, then you give her time to breathe, and then you give her time to remember who she was when she wasn't mommy. Because it's such a big identity shift. Yeah, actually that is valuable information. The best and the only other advice is never listen to anyone else's advice.

42:52 It's your house and your family. But but washing bottles is universal. Let me tell you. Let me tell you that one. Interesting. I'm going to get back to you on that one. OK, I will be following you. Oh, I put a song in to recommend. I was like Chris Isaak. I think I put. Wicked game. You know, I actually did a little snippet of it. Did you? Yeah. You just go back a couple videos and then you'll see it. You'll see it. I don't, I, I, I, I try not to do I have to be very selective of what I do full covers of and release on Spotify because I don't want my Spotify to just become like just covers and people think I'm just a cover artist, but. So do you always play with the same guys? It's like, what's the name of your band now? Well, so.

43:32 It's Skullboy. You're always wearing that T-shirt. That's like you're saying. No, it's because I own 3T shirts. I'm a minimalist. This is a pizza place I got. It's Schoolboy's Pizza Shack, and because I'm a bum, so it's a pizza place and yeah, and the pizza was pretty good. So yeah, maybe I'm endorsing School Boys. I forget where it. Is. Yeah, so I have the live band and then, but conveniently when I record, I just do everything myself and actually base I have. So when I record at my my bassist, I use his spot and he's a good engineer, so he engineers for me and then and then he'll play bass because he's a really good bassist.

44:18 So but everything else it's just me and him. And then live, I have a drummer and a keyboardist, so we could execute these songs live. So you touring people are going to want to now detour. Hopefully soon you know the the idea is just to get to a did. You say the name of your band. I don't think I even heard it. Well, it's just Francis Doom, OK? Yeah, I didn't know it was like your name or yeah. Francis Doom and the Schoolboys. You know, that's if that happens, I'm just saying I get credit. Yeah. Thanks, Holly. Yeah, you get a cut. Pizza place gets a cut. Now I'm hungry. But yeah, I know if it gets to a point where because it's funny, man, I used to hit the road when my previous bands like lose money, play to like 5 people in the venue and just because it's like, how else do you get your name out?

45:06 But now with social media, make a video, literally it's going to be seen by like, you know, a couple 100 at least. So it just has to make sense for me to tour to where I'm not going to lose money going out there. I think what I think a lot of people don't know that about artists in general. Like, so when you, let's just say you're on a tour, it's you driving, right, Right now, it's you getting your equipment, doing your sound checks. It's so much more goes into a performance, right? Like how many hours of work do you think goes into a performance? Well, I mean, it's not even the performance, it's just a getting there.

45:47 It's the gas, the rentals, the, you know, the lodging and the performance is such a small It's funny because that's the thing, right? That's what you're going out there to do. But it's such a small factor when when it comes to touring. Just saw the logistics of it, but sorry, I have to burp. You're going to mute thing. Can you meet this? No, he'll do it. OK. There maybe one no? It was nothing that was. You didn't even have to mention that. What's the most outrageous thing you've ever seen from stage looking out? Oh, you know, there was this, there was this, I remember there was this guy, not outrageous, like even in a funny way, but he was like, there was just like this guy, like trying to talk to this girl, right? And it was like in a sort of like romantic part of the song. And he's like trying to get her to like slow dance with her. And I remember being like my naive brain being like, oh, that's kind of cute because I thought they like, we're together, you know what I mean?

46:49 And then as I'm, as I'm, the song's progressing and I'm seeing them and I'm realizing, oh, she doesn't know him and she doesn't like this. And like, I almost like stopped the song and just like called the dude out. But then I like, thought, like, and literally this is all happening while like, words are coming, like singing is happening. And I'm like, but then like, am I putting her on the spot? Like, OK, let me just see how this resolves naturally. So what? And then by the end of the song, he fucked off. But but yeah, luckily we're not the type of brain band where we see crazy things. Like there's not like bras being thrown up at me or crazy mosh pits, you know, they're more like mush pits. I always say they're nice and just. Like, are people like this?

47:31 And you know, like your music was like this. Yeah. I think it's scientists. No, let's just like, what is that? This is like my Stevie Wonder. Just. Like this? I don't know, Do we? I'm looking at my hands over there. That's poison. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, they're a. Little more mellow. Yeah, yeah. So yeah, we're not. And that's, that's why like, it's very important that we rehearse and sound good because we can't rely on stage antics and energy. Like it's just we just play and that has to be enough. Because I'm not doing backflips. I'm sorry, I'm not Benson booting all over this. Stage presence. So are then You're the lead singer. It's your name.

48:13 Yeah, yeah. I, I, it's just me on guitar I sing and then keyboardist, bassist, drummer. And yeah, it's it's sort of a a minimal setup. So what do you listen to to get amped? Are you do you get amped before you go? Like do you have nerd? If you have ADHD, I know you're you must be a procrastinator, right? So I'm like. Refining my method, because in my previous projects I would sing actually like you, you wouldn't recognize my voice. I sing really high a lot of like falsettos and really just because it was like, I don't know, like my emo roots maybe just like singing at the top of my register. And so in those cases, I would definitely like try to get amped up.

48:54 And now I'm realizing that it's hard to sing a low when you're not relaxed. And so I would get amped up and then like come out and be like, like, so I have to sort of stay relaxed to some extent. And, and I see like like Billie Eilish performances and I'm so impressed by her ability to be like jumping around and then whispering like she her vocal control is like. She's an insane talent. She's insane. She's like my favorite like pop artist. I saw Olivia Rodrigo. Yeah, she's dope. She's dope. She put on a huge. I was like, I don't know, her show is insane. I was like, Oh my God.

49:35 And then Chapel Rhone opened for her, so I got to see her before she totally. It was fascinating. Yeah, I'm, I'm definitely, you know, a lot of indie artists would sort of stick their nose up at pomp. But I like pop. Pop is dope. And everything I'm like, I'm just kind of eclectic. OK, so what's your like? What success do you want now? Like what's your like? I don't know. I don't know. We won five years. I don't really care. Like I'm just like, what are you hungry for? That's. What I want to know my dream is to be famous enough to pay the bills with with just my craft, but never famous enough to where people that don't like like me having OK, so all right, so I know what you're saying. You know what I'm saying, cuz like, OK, like let's take one of my favorite bands, seagull rolls, right, They're a band from Iceland.

50:30 And if you don't, if people that let know them love them and the people that don't love them just don't know them. So they're not like so big to where everyone has to have an opinion on them. It's not like Benson Boone were like you have to love or hate him. It's like. It's a stash though, just saying. I mean, I think the Stevenies. Porn stars. I think he's a. Very talented young man. I'm impressed by him. I agree. But but yeah, like, but certainly they're paying their bills with their art and that's just the sweet spot. But what's paying your bills? Like I want dream big. All right? So if, you know, I'm woo woo, right? I got the thing and you're gonna like speak something into creation with that. Yeah.

51:11 Growl of yours, right. For the family, that for whatever life that you want, Yeah. My definition of success is I can travel wherever I want in the manner in which I want. That would be dope. That would be dope. Yeah. I'm not. You know, again, I don't need more than three shirts, but but I don't need. I'm going to have to find a pizza place from here and just like, I don't, I don't know where you live, obviously. Wait, let that be a thing where I only wear pizza shirts. Let that be a thing. That's. My new gimmick I don't need. We're going. To have to do a thing and you're going to have to get APO box and we'll see how many shirts you get. OK, this is my new dream. Can I change my dream? I don't even want to do music anymore.

51:52 I just want to get this cool piece of shit. But yeah, I don't need a lot of nice things. I have no desire for a fancy car. I have no desire for a watch, you know? But traveling sounds dope. Yeah, I like that. That sounds appealing. And traveling on tour is different. Like like we're talking about before, like when you go to a place on tour, you go, you sound check, you hit up the nearest like pizza place for food and then you play your show and then you're out of there. You don't really get to take a place in. So, yeah, you know, it's so success would be like, yeah, enough money to take care of myself and the people that I love and and but not to the point where like I need to fucking Rolls Royce. Like, let's be real.

52:38 Like that's ridiculous. I don't know, like things don't define you, they don't make you happy, they can't fill you up. So. I also think it says something about you if you do own a rolls. Like like you could have done so much with that money. That's what you decide to get. Like fucking hell. Travel agent who just came across my TikTok. I don't I think it's live or sounds like live or that's what I'm making it up to be now anyway, but she deals with like this Uber rich and like a call in was I brought my Pomeranian. It needs a Butler. Yeah. I'm like, dude, you have not faced any challenge in your life. I'm thinking a small challenge might make you more interesting, which I know is a big judgement, but it's true.

53:21 I think I've been through some crazy things and quake. So like, yeah, it's crazy. So you know who shows up for you and you know who won't? And then like, I like nice things. Like before I hit record, I told him, like, I grew up on Long Island. And my big joke is I don't identify as a New Yorker because New York's not my spot. But like, all the stuff, it just, it just, it can't make you happy. It can't. It just, it doesn't work. Just doesn't work. That's and that's it would seem that way. Right. Like like it sucks when you lose it. Oh my joke about. Long Island is I still like like mascara and a good leather jacket.

54:01 Like I just can't like those are kind of ingrained. I I do, I do love a good, well, good news is it doesn't cost an arm and a leg. For mascara and a good other jacket. Exactly. You know, I mean that that stuff is. Not even about. Like, listen, if you love driving nice cars because it feels so good, like, OK, fine. Like, you know, I mean, it's your money, do whatever. But what the sad thing is, is a lot of those times, it's not even because they love those things that they're not really into the mechanics of a watch. They just want a fancy watch because they want to project something about themselves. It's just peacocking. And So what do you want to project? What do you want people to see when they watch? You.

54:41 I just hope they like my music. It's like the shy side of you is fascinating. OK, we want they'll like your music obvious. I mean, that's it. There's nothing else I have to offer the world. I mean it's that's it. Like does does your other? I don't know, everyone says partner nowadays. Is your other half, are they into music too? Are they not into music? Do you guys have a line between that not? I mean, yeah, she's into music. Not to the extent that I am, but to the like. Yeah. And a healthy relationship with music and the arts. Is she bound? Like, did you play like, Oh my God, I love this and. She's like yeah or or because I don't always share what I'm.

55:23 Rating with my family. Because like they're the harshest girl. I'm like, oh, she's too sweet. Because I do show her like the in. The in the early, early demo stages, like ideas and it's always positive what you need to believe. She's a liar. But but maybe I could gauge it on like the level of positivity if she's like, oh, fuck yeah. Or if she's like, oh, this is really good. Like maybe 1 means what it sucks and the other means is actually good. But but she's she's very, very sweet, very supportive. And she comes from like contemporary modern dance. So she can appreciate just being obsessed with an art and diving into it, you know?

56:03 So she gets that. Yeah. Yeah. So music lives in her too, right? Yeah. She just. Expresses it differently. Yeah, good. Yeah, good way of putting. That I like that. That's true, right? It's just it moves, yeah, it moves through OK. So you guys all move. That's good. I was like, oh, my ADH, like I'm picking up on you. You're like my body is like buzzing, like the nicotine is kicked in. Like has my nicotine traveled through this microphone into your? Headphones, that's the whole thing about like, being empathic. Clairvoyant. Like you just feel so much. It's like wow, wow. You're like you're nervous, like you're sound like how I feel like looking at you. If you want to hear, it's like from here. It's not even my elbow, but it's like from here down is like jittery now.

56:46 Wow, interesting. I know. I think a good song will come out of it. I mean, like you said, frequencies have a. Physiological effect. So maybe certain, maybe it's certain frequencies in my. I don't know. All right, so I'm gonna like we're. We're ending. We're coming to the end of our time here. So I, I want to give your very loyal friends a chance. So I, I'm gonna, I'm if you're actually down for the T-shirt thing, I think, I think we should see the T-shirts. Like we need pizza T-shirts. Oh yeah. You know I don't have APO box set up. And I'm not about to give out my home address, no. No. Don't give out your home address. We'll cut all that out. I was just like. If you do like I'm like, oh, and whatever you don't want, we can like donate somewhere. I don't know.

57:29 Would you be down for something like that? Wait, people, I'm not going to. Donate it. I'm keeping all of them. Whatever comes my wait, you want me to give some away? I don't want to do that. OK, no, no giving, it was. Just seeing if you are. Generous, but obviously. No way. All right, you. You let me know if you're. Down and I can always add but I think that would be OK. How about this if anyone out there has a pizza? T-shirt. DM me and I will send you my home address because that's how much I want. They have to leave a comment here. We love them here. Yes, yes, yes. Leave a comment here. What do I point anywhere? OK, just leave a comment. And what you're Will.

58:12 I'm gonna figure out a way I can. I can make something happen. OK? I'm just gonna leave it in your hands. I love. That I love like. The challenge of it, can you see my eyes lighting up? I just got energized. I'm like, oh, an impossible task. Yes, I'm going to make this happen. I'm going to benefit from this. So I'm just going to let you. I'm not. A stalker and you don't have to give me your home, we can figure. Out someplace, it's a pizza place. Nearby to. Like drop them, give like your best friends. All right, so I end every interview with the same question, which is if you came with a warning label, what would it be? This product contains nicotine.

58:52 Nicotine is an addictive chemical. Sorry, I'm literally reading it from my I think that's epic. No, this product contains high sugar, may give you diabetes. Did I tell you what my mine is? So what is yours? You don't have to be. Mine is. We'll talk about chorea. Huh? My warning label is. We'll talk. And that's. I could probably learn about something a thing for. Two from you. I don't. I don't know about that. My husband doesn't. Understand the obsession. I was like, it's a completely different culture. It's everything. I don't know. The food is good. And now I I learned to cook a bunch of it and he's like, Oh my God. So you've been yeah, twice. OK, so next time we go.

59:33 Next time you go, we're going. We're going. We're just going to go together, OK? Because I'm long overdue for a visit. So we'll just go over there have you like I'm guessing you go off and you have family. It's been like a very long time. I've been like 3. Times in my life and I don't know any of my family that's can you still speak? Could you? Can you speak Korean, Hung? People say I sound like a baby. Well, that's. Like Aggie Aggie. They say it's cute but I just think I sound dumb. I I speak like a 2 year old. I only know. I keep trying to learn I have a very. I can't keep it. It just doesn't stick. It doesn't stick. I don't know why I can't get any better, but I'm good enough to be polite and be treated very kindly when I'm there.

1:00:14 And yeah, good energy. So I'm sure you don't need to know Korean. Or English, I like to tell everyone I'm ajama close so they have to be nice. Nice, that's true. Well, thank you so much so. Everyone has to find and follow you. Where do you want them? I know you're trying to get them over onto your Instagram right now, but where Instagram, TikTok, just search Francis. Doom. There's a couple of fake accounts of people pretending to be me, but just, you know, do follow the one with the most followers. Yeah, and Spotify and Spotify. And don't forget, I mean, yeah. Spotify. Apple Music, Amazon, all the music platforms, that's actually good call. That's actually where I want them. I'm like taking them to the commercial, to the product. Just go to the product.

1:00:59 Yeah, I got you, I got you. We're good now. I found the rhythm. I found the rhythm okay. And everyone leave a comment and we are. And if you want to donate a pizza T-shirt, say I will donate a pizza T-shirt, and we'll get in touch with you to clarify, she said. A pizza T-shirt, not a piece. Of T-shirt, just so I don't get pieces of T-shirt. That would be interesting. We can make one whole. Pizza T-shirt and make sense. OK, anyway. Sorry. Anyway, so we want a pizza parlor. A pizza joint T-shirt? I don't know. I know now I got the Italian hand going. Let's, let's give Francis more than three shirts. So thank you for listening to the Holly Hughes podcast and we'll see you real soon.

1:01:45 Bye.