Through the Fire: Wendy Valentine Talks Creativity, Overcoming Depression, and the Journey to Self Discovery

0:04 It's so welcome to this episode of the Holly Hughes Podcast. I am exceedingly, ridiculously excited to talk to Wendy Valentine, who is the host of her own amazing and popular podcast, the Midlife Makeover podcast that I got to be a guest on, but whatever. And she is an author and her book is coming out and it is women waking up. And thank you, Wendy, for coming. I am wearing pink for you because it's your. Color, look and look. And I've got my pink glasses. And the nails. And the lips. I know. I mean, you know, it always brightens your mood a little bit, right?

0:47 Just add a little color. Well, you. Brighten my mood because like I told you before we hit record, I was I'm a little cranky. Life has been lifing a little bit lately. So but like you are just sparkles, sparkles which will lead into parts of your book. But I don't I don't really want to jump ahead. This podcast is really about creative people talking about what it is to live a creative life, so we have a lot to cover with you. We do, right? Yeah, we do, yeah. A lot. And I'm going to split between like your podcast and your creativity and your bravery, right? Because I don't know that you touch upon your bravery at all in your book. You were like, and then I picked myself up and then I decided I'm not going to be depressed.

1:35 And then that bitch in my head, I told her, shut up. And I was like, but to do that and feel all the things that you have to feel to get there. I. Think you downplay the Meg the huge amount of work you did to do that so I would like to 1st. Yes, like it will. Sarcastically give you applause but like there's that meme going on. Like the women applauding themselves for doing things and. You're gonna have Andy make a a meme from of us right now I. Mean, I would really much more do a booty shake because I like to dance, right? Like that would be my thing for you and I, I probably mistakenly feel like we're slightly friends at this point because I always just want to talk to you. But so tell me I my first question, my honest first question is do you think you were always creative and just didn't know it?

2:29 Oh no, I believe we're all creative. We're all creative in different ways, right? I think with the the way my life went for 20-30 years that I did quite get to really be creative the way I wanted to be. Deep down, I always knew I would be a writer or a public speaker or have my own show. I knew that. But like you said earlier, life happens, right? Like shit happens. And so you just keep going and going and going and then sometimes you'll wake up and go, wait a second, what am I doing? Where, where am I at?

3:17 Who am I? So back story. I know you've read my story, but yeah, so mid 40s. I, let's see, went through divorce, chronic illness, I had black mold toxicity, Lyme disease, and we'll throw in menopause. That's for fun. Yeah, it's so fun. It's so fun. The night sweats and everything. And I was unemployed and then had a massive amount of debt and within a six week period, my dog died, my cat died, and then my brother died. So Needless to say, I was a little depressed, suffering from anxiety and panic attack. What did?

4:02 Depression like look like for you like because I I it's it's sneaky, right, because it can kind of like creep up on you and then suddenly you're like, Oh my God, I'm that woman on the TV show saying are you depressed? I don't want to get off the sofa. I'm not really hungry or rabbit like which what? What was it like for you that way, that feeling of it it? Was odd for me because I always had to be happy and lift everybody else's spirits up. So I didn't have time for depression. But depression was literally like, no, you, I'm going to shove you down into the cushions of the couch until you face all of this. So depression was pretty challenging for me. It just really shocked me.

4:47 I didn't like it. I mean, who does? But I, I didn't like it because I didn't, I didn't feel like myself at all. But it made me face that dark night of the soul, right? And I had to take a really strong look at my life and myself and I couldn't figure it all out overnight. The old fashioned way of what I used to do. I'd plan everything because I was such a perfection you. You are a planner, by the way, I could tell your book is very like detailed, right? You're like, which is no, it really is good. I am as a writer, a panster. Like for me, like I come at creativity as like I have this overwhelming feeling, an emotion, a truth, a story, an idea that I I have to get out right. And then I just vomit on the page and then I work all the, the business side of it much later. But going through your book, you were like, no, this first, no, bitch, this first, slow up, No, go back to this. Okay, now that I've given you this and you've conquered it, now I'm gonna give you this.

5:54 Are you paying attention? You're this and then this like I was like. You know one thing, I know we're hopping around a little bit, but I have found that most of us creatives, well, we're all creatives, but writers and artists, right? We create what we needed. And so I created this because it's what I needed. I needed this guide book to tell me this is what you need to do to get out of this funk and get out of depression and to change your life and to be a new woman. I needed that. And I'll admit, like I went to Barnes and Noble one day. This was in the because I was so depressed.

6:36 I was like, I'm I'm going to Barnes and Noble and get a new book because that'll solve my problems, right? And I got a little cup of coffee and I'm looking in the self help section, which is my section because I've read all the books and then I thought none of them. They're all great and amazing books, but it was more fluff and less formula. I wanted, I needed someone to tell me exactly what to do. And so I remember thinking as I stared at that bookcase, I was like, one day I'm going to write a book that actually tells a woman, this is what you need to do to feel good again and to feel. Yeah.

7:20 I love that you said formula, and I find that scientific part of your mind fascinating because because your personality is big and vivacious and what? What's your superhero? Which one is it? Which? Superhero. Are you superhero, Spark? I'm going to guess you're probably Sage. You think Sage? I thought the first one. Spark, I think we're a blend of so superheroes, Spark and then Sage, they're both creatives. Spark is a little bit louder. I'm definitely not. That anymore? I'm definitely not that. You're definitely the spark. No, there was. Wait, I literally wrote it down. Where's my? No. I did, I think I thought I wrote Spark at first, but I think a little bit of sage. I mean like it depends on my mood, right, Where I own my moods.

8:05 But what I did when I went to a Barnes and Noble, literally also a Barnes and Noble, bless them because I had a book signing there too. But before my book went out, I went through their self help. I was like, this isn't really anything that I like. And my book was now a couple years old right now. It is not then. And I went and put my business card inside of every self help book. Awesome, I. Did I was like if you want this, you should maybe just. Yeah. For me, let me let me help you through this. Lips thank you there's a bookmark for you and by the way, by my book that's awesome that's like that's master marketing skills right there I. Also dropped my book off in in Korea, right? Because my thing is I talk about Korea. It's a Starfield library and it's massive and it's beautiful and it's in a lot of K dramas. And I went there and I met some women. We became like friends.

8:53 I love these women now, but they helped me put my book into the library. I went into the self help. It's on the 2nd floor. I've had someone go back and it was still there, but now it's not there. They probably were like, what is this English language book in the Korean library? But that was fun too. Heard of being a little bit daring but. OK, wait. Back to. Yeah, going back to that moment. And I just realized that if my life was going to change, I had to change. I had to have those real conversations with myself. So I just. And it's silly, but I had I always had this dream of driving an RV across the country.

9:38 And here it was, you know, I was 45 years old and I thought, Oh my gosh, my 50th birthday is coming up and I wanted. To in between people I just thought she's rushing the process there's. 5 Now I know, but First things first, I had to get a job and I got a job in Chicago selling houses. I love that. New construction houses. I never, I have never done that before. And I thought, what the hell did? Did you ever watch this Seinfeld episode with George Costanza when he did the opposite day? Oh my. Gosh, yes, secret. And I remember thinking I was like, you know what, What if I just do the opposite of everything that I've ever done and just go for it?

10:20 So I did. I got a job in Chicago and four weeks later I moved from Virginia to Illinois. Had never really been there before, maybe change planes there once or twice before and got there on a Saturday. Started my new job on Monday with the full intention of I am going to one day buy an RV and take off across the country. Here's what was different from with the old Wendy. The old Wendy would not have even made a move unless she had everything laid out. Perfectly laid out. Because I am a recovering perfectionist. People pleaser, Co defendant, approval seeker.

11:02 That's me again. I was like, none of that has worked for me in the past. I have got to change my ways and I did. So I worked my ass off and then, you know, recovered from chronic illness. I seeked therapy so I could recover from the depression, the anxiety. It was little. Steps, each one. Not trying to reinvent myself overnight because Rome wasn't built in a day. The new you and your. Break helps women do the same exact thing. It helps other people be like, OK, I can do this concrete step, this works.

11:43 This will help support me in making this happen. And I can you can also, you have that beautiful tool of evaluation, right? Like to really evaluate, is this working? What's my scale? How high or low am I at? You know where am I at? The wheel of midlife. Yes, yes, yeah. It's really. And I, you know, I still look at that. I still think now I do it kind of in my mind. But I think about those 8 categories of life, right? Family, finance, health, career, friends, love, leisure and growth. And if you from zero to 10, if you rank it 0 being totally dissatisfied to 10 being satisfied and fulfilled, where do you rank each category of your life?

12:25 And it is such a good way to do that, to evaluate your life. Just go, OK, where do I need to fine tune some things? Where, how? Maybe I need to be sleeping better. Maybe I need to be to improve my finances. Maybe I need to save more. Maybe I need to play more, maybe I need better relationships. And it's not the point of I don't believe that you have a perfectly round wheel that is always rolling smoothly. It'll always be a little bumpy because that's life, right? And that the goal isn't to have a perfect life. The goal is we. Don't do perfect. We do. We don't do perfect. I cannot be perfect. I can't do it anymore. I don't it's. Fake, it's not really do it. It's like perfect. It is scared perfect is they're scared. I'm not living up to this expectation. My expectation.

13:11 You are what? How do I need to make things better here? How do I get a sense of control over what is going on? I'll make this look this anytime I walk into someones house and it's Immaculate and every pillow has that crease and there's no dust and there's nothing on the kitchen counter, especially if there's nothing on the. I don't trust them. I know they're so out of control in some aspect of your life, like not yours, but of their life. Yeah. Just like I'm like, I can't wait to hear the story that's coming out or the confession because people always before I started like working as a healer, people would confess these wild things to me. I'd be like, you don't have to tell me that like. I. I don't know you like we don't you don't have to just like tell me so you feel better, but like, yeah, that that need for perfection or even when people are there's like looking beautiful and feeling good about yourself, however and whatever that is for you. But then there's also.

14:05 Just embracing who you are, just embracing the messiness. Life gets messy, we get messy. It's totally OK. And I think done is better than perfect, right? Just do it. And Speaking of, there was a quote that I had. It was above my laptop during that, my midlife meltdown, if you will. I don't like to call it a crisis. It's a bit of a meltdown. And it's from Marianne Williamson. And it's our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. And here's the really important part that you need to listen to. It is our light, not our darkness, that most frightens us.

14:47 And I remember sitting there one day at my desk before I had started changing my life, and I asked myself, OK, Wendy, what if? What if you fully stepped into your light? Not Even so much What would I do? But who would I be? Because if we were to fully step into our light as a creative, as a human being, who would we really be? And sometimes that's scary because that means that if you step into your light, you might need to make some changes in your life. Yeah. And for me, world. Rewards dark right now. Oh yeah. Rewards being an asshole or being judgmental or being horribly cruel, right?

15:32 So if you take what like the seven seconds of social media will tell you is important and then you apply it to you as a whole person, it just shrinks you. Right, Yeah, no shrinking. So it's, yeah, I think that's an important question we need to ask ourselves is who would I be if I fully authentically stepped into my light, stepped into my truth? What would I have to do to be that person? Because sometimes you, you might have to quit a job. You might need to move across the country or to another country. You might need to leave a marriage. You might need, who knows? But to really give yourself permission to be the true you. It's that's, that's where the courage is. And it's not I, you can't do it for anybody else, right? We all know that.

16:26 Like we can't change anybody else. We can. I can't give you a jar of courage. Like let's say here's my glass here. I can't. Like, here you go. Here's a big old jar of courage for you. OK, Holly, you go and take that and just do whatever the hell you want. I had to fill this up myself. You have to fill up your jar of courage yourself. And you do that by taking action. So it's not like you have this one aha moment after another in your mind. You're like, okay, now I'm ready now I'm ready to fully go all out in my life. No, you start to take the steps, you stumble, you take another step, you stumble and it's just being okay with it. It is about being messy and but every single thing is so rewarding.

17:13 Even when you stumble it is so reward. I didn't know how to drive a freaking RVI. Know I'm so impressed by that I mean can I stay in the lines I. Don't know. I know. I know all of it. I didn't know how to do any of it. But there's that. That quote of leap in the net will appear. You leap and the net will appear and you realize the net isn't outside of you. It's not that someone tosses you a net. You are the net. Now you're in, right? Yeah. I think what is also fascinating in getting to know you over the past like 2 years, I think, yeah, right. Is that your evolution, right. And your comfort, it's like it's really interesting. You and I have sort of similar stories in that like I had a bunch of horrible things happen.

18:04 I moved across the country, I didn't know anyone. I crashed on my friend's floor and I was like, well, if this person who wasn't all that smart, I know that's judgmental, just go with me. So anyway, this guy that my friend was sleeping with moved to LA and he got a job. Was like, if they hired him, they'll hire me. I was like, are you hiring? I called, they're like, can you start Monday? I said yes. I left my roommate four months of rent and left. I didn't know anything. I just kind of like I did that leap. But at the same time, just like you also mentioned in your book, wherever you go, you are taking you with you. You can't just like pick up and erase everything. You can start over. You can make a lot of different choices. And then I moved from LA back down to North Carolina, which if you ever told me I was going to live here as long as I have and do, I'd be like you. No, but it was a choice that was good for my family. Right.

18:55 And remarkably enough, my creativity took off in a place where I feel like an outlier, which is like, fascinating. In LA, my weird is so normal. It's like, yeah, everyone is like that. You know, when I got there, I was like, Oh my God, I'm. I'm not weird at all. I've just been in the wrong spot. But I couldn't play the toxic game forever there, which there is. There's a little selling of your soul. I think for me, when it comes to film and entertainment like film and TV stuff, you have to have a level of needing to be seen or needing to people please to make that creative Crucible work. Right.

19:38 Yeah. And it ultimately wasn't for me. And when I left there, that's where I actually when I found my voice as a writer interesting. Find your voice as a writer. How was that process for you? Well, so this actually just came up the other day and I kind of forgot about it, but I fell in love with writing when I was a pastry student in Paris. I know. And this was, oh, gosh, I'm so bad about time. Maybe 10 years ago. So I, yeah, I was like, you know what? And I love cooking. I love baking. I'm a really good French pastry chef.

20:20 And if I'm registered for myself? Is that why it's so hard to get rid of the pans? When you moved into the RV? Was that the way? No, I still, I still saved one of my chef coats. I was like, cannot get rid of it. Anyway, so this was when I was living back in Virginia and I was like, you know what, I'm going to go to pastry school. I always wanted to do that. This was the time when I was trying to figure out what the heck am I going to do with my life? Am I going to be pastry, you know, a chef? Am I going to be a yoga teacher? What the hell am I doing? And I was like trying anything and everything. So everyone was asking me, this was a little bit, not before social media, before we were really sharing a lot of our lives on social media. And people were asking, well, how are we going to know how you're doing in school in Paris? And I was like, maybe I'll start one of those blogs, you know? So I in every single day I wrote on Tumblr every single day I did my blog, I went to school, walked back to my little apt, I got a baguette, chocolate and bottle of wine and I sat on my little tiny little balcony and I wrote about my day. And within nuts, within about six weeks, I had over 80,000 subscribers and that nuts And I was like, why are these people wanting to read about my day in pastry school? And I, that was when I really, I fell in love with writing and just letting my, my soul speak without being limited, just writing whatever I wanted to

21:53 write. And it wasn't anything. I didn't have to come up with anything. I was my day, my, that was my subject. And it was kind of fun because then when every day would start, I was like, wonder what's gonna happen today in school or outside of school? Walking, walking. I mean, I love one of the things I love to do was baking all the pastries during the day. And then after school, when I was on my way home, I'd feed the homeless. That was one of my highlights. Love that. So I'd write about that. And here's the this is to answer your question. Finally, one day I'm in the locker room now this school is in Le Cordon Bleu in Paris and people come from all over the world to go to the school.

22:39 And this German girl comes up to me. She's probably mid 20s. And she said, are you go Wendy go. That was my handle name. And I was like, yes. And she goes and it makes me want to cry. She goes, I want to thank you so much for writing every single day. She said I found your blog and it inspired me to follow my dreams of becoming the pastry chef and I. Was like whoa. Like that, the power of words, of creativity, of sharing, of just allowing yourself to fully be can change someone's life. It's fascinating, so.

23:22 Like you have like no insecurity, like insecurity about it though. That's the part that I. Find. Oh, I do. I do. But like, that's part. Of they don't care. How do how does it show up or what does it sound like for you or like, you know, there can be days like I like to tell people who are not creative. Sometimes creative people need downtime. Yeah. We need distance from stuff we're working on or we need space, or there's an idea and it's not fully formed. Like that's part of my process. And then I can accomplish more in an hour and a half when I'm focused. And a lot of people can in two weeks, like, I'm just like, I'm there, I'm in the zone, stay away, don't talk to me. So what is your, like, process?

24:06 Like how do you ride the high and the low? The little bumps in your wheel? OK, epiphany. Epiphany right before I no, well, not right before. Actually it was right after, excuse me, after I took off in the RV across the country. I know we're kind of like back and forth, but people. Can follow. Yeah, people can follow. Y'all got this. I took off in the RV and my first step, first stop was Santa Fe, NM, and there I ended up doing a ketamine journey. There was just an awesome, yes, it was amazing. And during that whole journey, the one that the thing that I needed the most was this one epiphany and it was Wendy get out of the way. I was basically my soul telling me you need to step aside because I was blocking.

25:06 We all do. We block ourselves, we all, we do it all the time. It's ridiculous. We are our worst critics and enemies. It's so sad. So from that moment forward, I thought, OK, what if I what if I just step aside? What if I allowed my heart to just feel whatever it wants to feel, Let my soul say whatever it wants to say, even if it's not said perfectly or written perfectly. I, I was, I was so exhausted being a perfectionist, I could not do it anymore. I, I, and the thing I realized is that I had spent half of my life considering if I am lucky enough to live to 100, I spent half of my life making sure everyone else was happy and that I was perfect.

25:59 So everybody else was happy and everyone is good and let me do all of this and this and this. And in the end I was like, shit didn't matter and I was miserable because I wasn't being my true self. I was I was living life for everybody else. So was your voice different? Like did you look different? I'm so curious because I can't imagine you any. Other way right I think. People who know me, you might know. Slice. Of me, you'll know, you'll be like, that's how I didn't wear my hair curly today because I can't compete with your amazing curls. And I'm just saying. So I blew it out for you last night after dance class, but. No, I like it.

26:43 Yeah, but I'm like, I'm curious as to like what you look like if when I see pictures of me when I was deep in my people pleasing. Yeah, like my, there are moments where, you know, my smile is the same and stuff, but it's it's in the eyes, right? Uh huh. When I look back, it's so funny because one of the things I did and part of my decluttering, because since I sold everything, one of the things I did is I went through thousands of photographs so that I could scan them, right. And in that process, you, you take a little, you know, travel through your, through your history, and I'm looking at all these pictures. I couldn't even connect with that girl or that young woman.

27:27 I was like, and I actually felt really sorry for her. I felt bad for her. Like I just wanted to hug the picture because I was like, aw, that poor thing. If she only knew that she's wasting her time with all of the bullshit that she worries about. It's not freaking worth it. It is so not worth it. So I always appeared to have my shit together on the outside that on the inside I was always questioning myself. I was always worried. I was always thinking, just thinking and thinking about the most ridiculous stuff. Is this good enough? Is that exhausting? I couldn't, I couldn't keep up with that and I had to give myself permission to just be and to just allow and just just and don't, right?

28:14 Don't we like we see some of these people that are out there, whether they be, you know, movie stars or someone on Instagram, that they're just bold AF and you're just like, damn, that is it's refreshing. I think there's a difference. I think for me, because I can read people right. Yeah, right. Sometimes. I'm looking at them. I'm like. Yeah, yeah. Like what I like. I know what's really going on. You need to stop. And I would rather be honest. Like I always tell people I'm Moody, but I own my moods. So yeah, my dog died last week, so I was very, very. Well shit, no wonder you're having a shitty week. Exactly.

28:54 You're the third person to tell me that. But now that it's done, everyone's pets are safe. But so I am. Sorry. That's thank you. I'm a delayed. I go deep and then I'm kind of not on the planet. Like my husband was like, hello, where are you? I was like, I didn't know how I was. See, I'm getting upset. I didn't know how I was gonna like react, but like I didn't realize how often in the day I reached for him or spoke to him or touched him 'cause I work a lot from home so he was always. Oh, you're making me cry. Right, so he's you, you keep your puppy with you too. So like, you know that connection and and then like, where are you? And then I was like, oh, sometimes when I'm in that deep grief, we'll just call it grief, right? Sometimes some of my best ideas or stories or thoughts or the start of something happens.

29:48 I find it really hard to be prolific, I guess, because I judge how good I could be, right when I'm super happy because I want to be in the moment of happiness. How about you? When you because you unpacked a lot, you had a great deal of loss. Yeah. In intense loss. Yeah. Like, So like, do you think that was part of, like, what cooked more of your voice and your creativity? And did you give yourself ever, like, permission to, like, write angry because, like, again, I can't. Yes. I've seen you worried, like when your car was on fire. Don't even get me started. When I saw that video I was like girl you're dragging a car that is on fire and don't tell me that 2 angels didn't show up and unhook it for you.

30:37 What? Was that not weird? That was a trip. 22 good old boys just like jumped out with, you know, just fire extinguisher. So to answer your question, yeah, the emotional. Part like so right now, like you have this huge book, you did the proposal you you've been found, you have your boys, but are you more creative in an emotionally charged space? I allow to whatever comes up comes up. And the way I look at it too, there's something for everyone out there. So some people might like Michael Jackson and some people don't like his music.

31:20 Some people prefer Kid Rock. I don't know, right, But so that's the way I look at it, like even with this book, some people might hate it, some people might love it, some people might have transformation. Some people be like, well, it didn't do a damn thing for me, whatever. Like you have to like to have this Nice just. How did you said even about it? Like, like, are you asking? My words are out there. No, this is fascinating too. My roses comes out in that part and you're like, no man, I'm good. Yeah, you have to be detached because what is worrying gonna do? I don't know that I'm worried. I that's a really good question. I'm like, I'm really good about doing the work and putting it out there.

32:02 Like I feel good, but then knowing it's out there, then I'm like, oh, this like, you know, these strangers can leave like weirdo, I get some weird comments. I can't imagine what you get right. Oh God. Oh, yeah, they're so creepy. Like especially like on TikTok, I give it, I, I looked, I never go on my messages. And then I looked on there one day and I was dying, cracking up. And these guys like, I want to be your, I want to be your sugar daddy. Give me your bills. And I wrote back, I was like, you don't want my bills. Trust me. You do not want my bills. Just. Just handling all my just paying for all my hair conditioner will kill you.

32:43 You know, I was like, no, you don't want my bills. But you know what, here's here's the thing, Here's the, here's the beautiful part of loss. You realize the beauty of life and the life that you're if like if you're listening right now, that means you're breathing. We hope so. It means you're living life. It is a gift when I think back, not to be like everyone, pull out your violin and feel sorry for me. But my first husband died at the age of 26 years old, died in his sleep. We have no explanation for it, just his heart stopped beating at 26 years old so. Crazy. And then my brother died. Although drug addiction at 49 years old, still to have life means that you can be you.

33:34 And someday Holly Hughes and Wendy Valentine will be forgotten. Maybe. Might take 20 years, 50 years, but someday. So why do we give a shit what anyone thinks? Because we'll be gone. They'll be gone. Why does it matter? Like, why not just go all out and just see what can happen? Like why not? I love that. I agree. Why not? I mean, I, I, I do things like that can happen, you fail or it doesn't work and you get to do it again. Well, then, do you know what too? I think we ask ourselves that question of like, what is success?

34:20 You know, like, well, what is success? What's success to you and to me? Well, what is failure? What is failure? I mean, it's the opposite, but who's to say what is a failure? I mean, I don't know how many times like the the light bulb was trying to be invented. And what if they just gave up after one time? Well, that was a failure. Like thank God. I mean, I've got this gigantic ring light in front of me right now. So thank God we have thank God they pushed through, you know, so I just don't believe. I don't believe in failure. I just don't. Like I always wanted to be a writer and when I was in film and TV, when I was leaving my starter marriage because it was horribly abusive and I was like, I wanted to write, so let me learn to write again. And you know, I was working 12-14 hour days plus an hour commute.

35:08 I was like, where am I sneaking in? Like it's not like I can go somewhere, but I somehow I managed. I took a UCLA Extension creative writing class and I found out I was terrible. I was a terrible writer, and it's just because I hadn't used it. I hadn't owned my own creativity because I thought that this person was better or this person was better. If I give them my idea, they'll make my idea better. Now that's just crap. That's just crap. And we don't have to monetize everything in this as a creative person. But if you don't actually let it out, I think it weighs on you. It weighs on your soul. It makes you feel like dull and less than it. I think it doesn't let you fully step into, like you said, your light.

35:53 Right. I mean, I wasn't doing any of my creative work for decades. But pastry? I was. Doing a cooking because I hate cooking and I'm a good cook and I'm resentful. I'm resentful of that. Like I don't understand the joy of breaking everything out. That's just not your thing. That sort of thing ain't your bag, baby. Just embrace it. You just, you don't dig it, don't do it. I have the craziest craving for baked clams like. Interesting. No, it's really weird. I came home from dance class last night and I walked in the house. I was like, I want like, was it clams casino? It's like such a Long Island. Don't judge. That's where I grew up. Like it was such like when I grew up, when I was like, we used to go to this town at Port Jeff and like all the restaurants you had like all the stuff outside. I don't think people walk or do things in person anymore, but back in the day.

36:44 Yeah, yeah, yeah. And. As teenagers, we would like walk up and down. I remember eating like fried clams, Like I can't eat fried food now because, you know, the paws. But like, I'm just saying like all this stuff. And I came home. I was like, like saying it right now I'm getting really hungry. I was like, where do I get that here? I don't even know if it exists. I might have to cook it. I might have to figure that one out because I really, really want it, right? Like even like a thought like that for anyone who's creative, right? Like there's this need, there's a need to do something and get it out. I think that is the beauty of creative people in general. Like whenever your gift is in it, when you're deny it, you're not fully you. No.

37:28 Don't deny it. Yeah, and you have to figure out what works for you. Like I'm a I'm a morning creator. I mean, when I wrote my book, I wrote, I wrote it in 60 days over 65. I know 65,000 words in 60 days. You can tell it was like built up in me, but I, I got up at 5:00 AM and I went straight like in the dark and had a little light there in the kitchen and just boom, just did it. That's my style, though. There are people that like to. I have a friend, Camille, she would write 30 minutes every single day and that's how she did it. I couldn't do that because it takes me 30 minutes just to get into the groove.

38:09 You know, I'm like, I'm just getting going. I'm like, but that's how I am. But you have to figure out what works for you. Some people are afternoon writers or evening writers or whatever. You just. Or in the afternoon, that's. What I want to do I. Want to take a nap? I don't want to be creative. You try different things. As a matter of fact, you have to allow yourself to try different things and to pivot when you need to pivot. For example, I just made a decision this week. Let's hear it. You ready? And as you know, I'm pretty active on social media and all the things and it it can be overwhelming. And I was like, I don't want, I don't want that.

38:50 I don't want to feel overwhelmed. I have the podcast. That's a lot of work, as you know, right. And I miss writing. I miss the I miss those old pastry days of blogging. I was like, I miss, I miss that. I want that style of it because you know, when you write a book, a published book, it has to be that part has to be perfect and goes through like 10 different editors, right? I miss that. So here's my decision in this last week instead of before I was on, I had three Facebook accounts pages and Instagram, TikTok, Pinterest, YouTube, one other one.

39:32 I said goodbye to YouTube and I said goodbye to TikTok and Pinterest and all I have now is 1 Facebook account, one Instagram account which those basically are the same, just different, you know, it's the same, same stuff. And I'm gonna start doing sub stack. OK so I have been avoiding sub stack. So you start and then you let me know because. Why? Because yeah. It's work. It's more work right now and I'm like, I know, I know podcast. I literally have 3. Three books in edit and I have a book due to an editor in like 2 weeks that I got. To let's talk about that, though, the overwhelm which happens with a lot of creatives where we try to put too much onto ourselves and then sometimes we just freeze. We get paralyzed because we put too much onto ourselves that we're not doing anything really.

40:28 I think for me it is the learning of a new thing, right? Like so honestly, my TikTok, I just started a new one for the podcast. Obviously there's like minimal followers. I was like, I'll just start that there. I go on TikTok to talk about K dramas, right? Like I always talk about this, right? Like I love Korea, so I watch that is like my Oh my God, I worked really hard. I've done all my public and private things. I've done all my business things, right? I have two businesses I'm running OK, and then I'm going to go chill out to these fantastical stories because something about it just makes me happy. So I'm just that's my happy place. So I don't care if I have a following because I just don't care. So I have like my Instagram and my favorite is just watching my numbers like go up 2000 and down, 2000 up and down. I'm like, you know what, like do I care? No, I don't like as I just want, I want. I started this podcast for camaraderie because sometimes as a creative, I feel really lonely because I'm in a town of bankers.

41:27 I'm in a like, there's super creative people around me, but we're all slightly introverted, right? It's lonely, doesn't it? Isn't that interesting though, as much as we're engaged and we're connecting, we're sharing, we're doing all the. Things but we're like so. Lonely out here? And then I retreat. That was one of my other reasons of doing that, because, yes, I have amazing guests like yourself. I think you were on twice, actually. Yeah, I know that I get to connect with, right, but it's more of a monologue. I put the audio out there and I'm like, I can look to see people are listening, but I don't get anything back. I'm like, OK, And then Facebook and Instagram, kind of same thing.

42:09 You're like putting the shit out there, like all right. And the reason I wanted the sub stack was for my own, my own soul to be able to get back into writing and to sharing and for connection. So you you do. What are you going to? Focus on though, is it going to be midlife makeover stuff or is it going to be more personal? Midlife ology so. It's a cocktail. You're you're sharing cocktail recipes. But you know, like just different ideas that I have that I want to write about. I don't always want to step in front of a camera. And I love the cameras. You know, I love recording, making videos, but I don't always want to do that. And I feel like that's what's lacking right now for me. So we have to tune into our muse and go, what do you need? So as we know, we'll get busy.

42:58 We'll get busy with writing or we'll be busy creating, trying different things. And we have to stop every now and then and be like, all right, what do you need? What's wrong? And it's like, what's that? That movie with the the baseball field? Build it and they will come, right? You just build it and they will come. Whoever comes comes, Whoever does and whoever listens, watches. Whatever it is that you're creating, you have to detach from that because whatever makes you feel good is going to be good. Oh. My God this is so funny. So forever. Bajillion years ago. So when I I mean, I was in my 20s, so like 17 lifetimes ago at this point. So I'm an intuitive people.

43:38 I could see here and feel things. I think the first, the first time we recorded, dude, you had a thing in your kitchen. I still like it was like this little goblin. I was like, that thing is annoying me. So I could just see it like hovering over your head. It was really wild anyway, but so like I have this thing and I got a reading and the gentleman who gave me the reading his his name is Tolo. That's what he goes by now. I forget what it means. Any it was a trippy experience for me because I mean like I knew I would get hits, but I had no control over any of my gifts. So like I didn't know what it was. I didn't know that you didn't have it. Like I there was like a lot of I didn't knows and we were sitting face to face and he opened his eyes and his eyes were completely black, like his pupils had dilated.

44:21 So like I was like, what the hell? And in this very first reading, he told me my spirituality was as big as a whale above me. And then my life had this meaning that I didn't even understand yet that I had secrets, that I and I had a lot of secrets at that time. I had been assaulted. I had like, I had a lot of things that I didn't tell anyone. Yeah. He's like, you have secrets, but we all know them, right? And then that and I think they were like you. Oh, I wanted the impossible in a man. They told me that my reading was like, you wanted someone emotionally available and masculine. And they're like, it doesn't come in a package like that. And then I know and then they told me later that that I would not be traditionally found like as a writer, as a creative. And that just see, I get mad.

45:09 That pissed you off? It pissed me off. Why did that make you mad? As you're telling me, I heard you're not good enough. You're not good enough. That's a. Great word, yeah. That's what I heard, what I heard as a young dancer. You're not good enough. You're not. Fuck yes, I am. So. Yeah. So that I always say that. Fuck you again. It's an adult content show, so fuck you as a fossil fuel. It'll only get you so far. Like if you don't have more to it, you'll burn out, right? It you can't sustain. But for me, like what I love listening about your process is you're like, yeah, my light. This is how it's coming. And for me it was, well, if this is what I want to write, I'm not a really good writer yet. Let me get better at writing again. Let me find, let me learn it. And then learning it.

45:52 And then I was like, oh, this is my voice. If you read my work, if it's an essay or fiction, you can know it's my work because the way I tell story, right? So there's that. And then there's the business of publishing, which is a whole other thing that has nothing to do with talent, everyone. It has nothing. And I've been in publishing long enough to like be here at the infancy of self-publishing and how the stigma of that has changed. And so for my ego, I was like, you're just telling me I'm only, I can only do that. And now I'm like, now I have a bajillion avenues different mindset, right? I have so many different ways of reaching people to share the stories that I want to.

46:34 And I am non linear. And what I love personally about like essays and memoir is that you could do those braided stories, right? That you can weave in this thought, this moment and like be like that. But so I find you fascinating because you are I'm a process person, right? I like, I need this, this and this, and I'm like, no, don't tell me the process, man. I'm going to do it my way like so where we have rules that affect us are in different, different spots along the journey. I think for me, it was for so long. Most of my life in my creativity had been cut off. I didn't allow myself to allow it to flow. So when I finally made that decision and turned on the faucet, I was like, it's go time. I love it because I was miserable. I was miserable without that, Yeah. And so do you still bake then?

47:31 Are you the cooking? OK, so you're, you're in. Can we say what country you're in? Do you like telling people? Oh, yeah, yeah, no, yeah, I'm on the island of, I'm on the island of Madeira, Portugal, which is actually closer to South Africa than it is to the mainland. But when I sold everything a few years ago after I rebuilt my life in in Chicago and then I took off in the RVI, sold everything except for a few boxes of French baking pans. So they are, they are right now in storage in Arizona and they're still there just in case if I can bring them here or who knows. I'm I'm kind of open right now to what life sends my way. Guys, you've been coming, you've been going to Portugal for a couple of years now.

48:15 Is that going to be, is that like your home turf in the summer or are you going to explore more? Yeah, no, I I definitely want to explore more. That was one of my reasons of coming here, just to be closer to be in Europe so I could freely because, you know, as an American, it's 90 days on, 90 days off. It's like that's exhausting. But in the RVI loved it and I still do. I mean, she's Felicia. Felicia's sitting in storage right now in Florida, probably sweating her ass off, but she. Is because it's super hot here. Oh. My God. So yeah, I still have the RV. But then what's nice was nowadays, I mean, with what we do, you can do it anywhere in the whole wide world, just need Wi-Fi.

48:59 So whether that's in the RV or it's here in Portugal, and I mean, shoot, I was on San Antonio and Portland Live. I've been doing all of these shows right here in Portugal. It's crazy. I think sometimes we, we forget all of the advancements that we have nowadays that people are like still keep themselves in this little box and like, you know, you can get out-of-the-box. You know, that's my own day. Like smash it, dance on top no? Box, Yeah, you don't have to stay in the same spot, yeah. I'm trying to figure out, I want to interview someone, but his English isn't good enough and my Korean is definitely not good enough. But he's fascinating. And I was like, I got to find an interpreter.

49:39 And I don't know how an interpreter would work on a podcast. I'm just like, I'm like, maybe that won't work at all. My my fantasy. But what I like about me is like, I'm trying, right? Like, I think for me, if you tell me no, I don't care. I'm just going for it. Yeah. So you say no, OK, not fit for you next. Like I was thinking when you said, yes, you're busy. You are busy. You have a lot going. On I love it. I love it, I love it, I love it. I love every ounce of it. All right, so sub stack and the next book you're like a three book deal with. Yeah, the next coming the next book is called What If? That makes sense. I know what if? What if you actually did all the things that you know you can do and want to do and? Like it?

50:25 Yeah, that'll have to be 2026 project. Yeah, that's half over. Yeah, it's everything's dedicated to this book now. Yeah, exactly. The old, the old Wendy would have been like, I can squeeze this in. Like, no, I do know. I do know that. And I'm a really hard worker because I love what I do now. But I also have realized that if I go on for too long without taking breaks or going to play and laughing and going out to dinner or whatever it is that I'm like, whoo, so I need that. But that's just learning. Learning what you need as you go through the process. OK. Excellent.

51:05 All right, so we've come to the end and they my favorite last question, which I like to tell people, I warn people I'm going to ask them this because some people don't like being caught off guard. If you came with a warning label, what would it be? Caution contents may inspire radical change in your life. I started with applause. I'm ending with applause. I love it. I like that one. That's yeah. There's no Chad GBT in that at all. I like that, No. That's it was either gonna be that I thought about that I was like or like better put on glasses because it's about to get bright.

51:51 Let her put on your sunglasses. About to get bright in here like. I don't even know how you see the camera without your glasses. Like I've noticed in my interviews sometimes like I could see. Is that like looking into the bifocal? It's terrible but they look cute. I know, and I like, yeah, I've got all the little different thingies. OK, Wendy, where can people find you? Where do you want them to go? And where do you want them to get your book? Cuz it'll be. Thank you. Yes. When does this air, when does this come out? Do you know yet? It will be in the fall, it'll be September, October. Oh that's perfect. OK cuz the book comes out man. The book comes out September 9th. Everyone at 99. The best place to go is wendyvalentine.com. That's the main hub for everything. You can find more about the book there. I mean, the book can be found anywhere. It's on Amazon of course.

52:43 Of course it's on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, everywhere. I'm on, as you know, Facebook, Instagram, and now sub stack as Wendy Valentine. Wendy Valentine. Thank you so much for being. Against. The Holly Hughes Podcast and anyone who's listening, go be creative. Yes, please. Go, go, go, go. Thanks.